Welkom bij Collie Chatter, een plek voor mensen die van Rough Collies en Smooth Collies houden. We behandelen verschillende aspecten van de zorg voor Collies en bespreken verhalen die de speciale relaties tussen Collies en hun mensen benadrukken. Ik ben Emily Sowulewski, een schrijfster die al meer dan 25 jaar collies heeft, en ik zal je gastheer zijn. Het nummer dat je hebt gehoord, 'A Dog on A Day', is van Jeff Hyman en is verkrijgbaar als single op Amazon of je kunt het hele album genaamd Old Dogs New Tricks kopen.
In deze eerste podcastaflevering heb ik een gesprek met Jeff Hyman, die in de jaren zestig zijn carrière als muzikant begon bij de folkband The Gaslight Singers. Hoewel Jeff altijd een hondenliefhebber was, had hij pas later in zijn leven persoonlijke ervaring met Collies. Nu is hij een toegewijde Collie-fan, en zijn Rough Collie Cody (die eruitziet alsof hij zelf in een jaren 80-haarband zat!) helpt hem zelfs om muziekalbums te verkopen. Samen bespreken we verschillende onderwerpen:zingen, de muziekindustrie, de verschillen tussen jachtrassen zoals Labs versus hoedende rassen zoals Collies, zindelijkheidstraining van een puppy, Collie verzorging en verharing, Collie populariteit, tandenpoetsen en mondhygiëne tools, Collie temperament en intelligentie, Collies met een gevoelige maag, Collies die kieskeurige eters zijn en andere unieke Collie-kenmerken.
Emily
Jeff, ik heb je Oude honden nieuwe trucs bought gekocht album, en ik vind het geweldig dat je een foto van Cody op de albumhoes bij je hebt. Ik moet zeggen dat ik het erg leuk vond om naar alle nummers te luisteren. Ik dacht dat we konden praten over hoe dat album tot stand kwam, en wat over je muziekcarrière.
Jeff
Ik beschouw mezelf als eclectisch, omdat ik liedjes in verschillende genres maak. Toen ik Old Dog New Tricks deed, werd dat album gemaakt aan de oostkust voordat ik hierheen verhuisde [naar Californië]. Het was niet mijn bedoeling om een album te maken. 'Love, Love, Love' was het eerste nummer dat ik met een paar vrienden van me opnam, en daarna vond ik het leuk klinken. Dus ik zei:"Wel, misschien doe ik er nog een." En voordat ik het wist, had ik – ik denk dat er tien van hen op dat album staan. Dus het gebeurde gewoon.
Emily
Dat is een nette manier om het gewoon te laten gebeuren. Ik bedoel, het klinkt alsof je een thema hebt; het klinkt alsof je het allemaal gepland hebt. Ik denk dat dat een beetje de magie is - als je zomaar in zoiets valt.
Jeff
Ja, ik kan niet zeggen dat ik het gepland heb, omdat ik de volgorde van de nummers niet meer weet. Maar wat er gebeurde, was dat ik nummers vond die ik leuk vond. Toen ik ongeveer drie of vier nummers verder was, werkte ik samen met deze meid, Beth Bradley. Ze zingt met mij op veel van de nummers op dat album, in het bijzonder "Somewhere in Time".
Jeff
En ze kende deze man, Rob Carlson, die in een band zat – ik ben de naam vergeten – een zeer, zeer getalenteerde singer/songwriter. Dus begonnen we elke woensdagavond samen te komen in zijn kelder. Ik zou een fles wijn meenemen, en hij had deze geweldige opname-setup. Ik heb daar niet opgenomen, maar we konden de koptelefoon met de microfoons opzetten en echt een geweldige tijd hebben.
Jeff
Dus ik leefde voor woensdagavond. Van die bijeenkomsten heeft hij misschien zes van de nummers op dat album geproduceerd. En hij deed het gewoon geweldig. Dus ik had hem, en ik had een andere meid die vroeger kwam - geweldige zangers. Beth speelt een geweldige gitaar, en het kwam gewoon uit informele bijeenkomsten dat we op ideeën kwamen die ons naar de studio brachten.
Emily
Dat klinkt heel leuk.
Jeff
Oh mijn God, ik heb ervoor geleefd! Ik was in die tijd aan het werk. Dus ik zou rond 6:00 of 06:30 thuiskomen van mijn werk en het avondeten zo snel mogelijk naar binnen slurpen om in de auto te stappen om naar Robs huis te gaan.
Jeff
Weet je, ik had al tientallen jaren geen muziek meer. Ik verliet The Gaslight Singers in '64, en ik denk niet dat ik mijn gitaar 30 jaar heb aangeraakt. En ik trouwde, voedde het gezin op, ging aan het werk en hield me er pas veel later echt mee bezig.
Emily
En toen had je tijd, en alles kwam samen. Dat is best netjes.
Jeff
Dus toen ik hier [naar Californië] kwam, dat is vier jaar geleden nadat ik met pensioen ging, wist ik gewoon dat dit een mekka voor muziek was. En ik kreeg al vroeg wat advies over hoe ik in de muziekgemeenschap kon komen. Dat is wat ik gedaan heb. Ik heb het andere album gemaakt, ik doe de radioshow en het is gewoon een deel van het geheel. Ik vind het geweldig en het betekent echt alles voor me.
Emily
Ja, dat is best wel inspirerend. Woensdagavond gaan mijn partner en ik met een groep vrienden rondhangen, praten over spirituele dingen en stellen dingen in vraag. Ik vond je nummer "Let the Mystery Be" echt heel leuk, omdat het verfrissend is om een perspectief te vinden van:"Weet je, misschien weten we niet alle antwoorden, maar dat is prima - maak je er maar geen zorgen over."
Emily
Maar we praten alleen over het leven. En ik realiseerde me dat bijna alle van ons in die groep formeel in verschillende groepen zongen, dus ik blijf iedereen zeggen:"We moeten een karaoke-avond hebben. Ze hebben een piano bij mijn vriend thuis. We zullen zien wat er gebeurt, gewoon voor de lol. Ik mis het zingen met mensen echt. Toen ik naar je album luisterde, had het een soort gevoel van verbondenheid met de stemmen die in elkaar overvloeiden. Ik realiseerde me gewoon dat ik dit nogal een beetje mis.
Jeff
Ja, weet je, als je het in je DNA en in je ziel hebt, is het echt iets dat je naar buiten wilt brengen en dat je wilt ervaren. Niet iedereen heeft het talent om dat soort dingen te doen, of het nu gaat om een instrument bespelen of goed zingen, maar dat maakt niet uit. Het enige dat telt is dat ze het doen en dat ze het leuk vinden om te doen. Omdat ik merk dat wanneer ik muziek maak, ik me in een zone bevind waar ik gewoon van hou. Het laat alles wat erin zit naar buiten, dus ik kan begrijpen waarom iemand dat zou willen doen.
Jeff
Weet je, andere mensen beginnen met atletiek. Ik was nooit atletisch. Toen we punch bowl of stickball speelden - ik ben opgegroeid in New York en we speelden die spellen - kozen ze de meisjes voor mij.
Emily
Ik werd meestal als laatste gekozen voor kickball toen ik opgroeide, dus ik kan het begrijpen.
Jeff
Ja, ik had een vriend van mij in het oosten, en hij was een geweldige basketballer. Hij was zo goed dat zijn baan in het leger bestond uit het spelen van basketbalwedstrijden voor de soldaten. Ik zei:"Neil, ik zou alles geven om een lay-up te maken zoals jij."
Jeff
En hij keek me aan en zei:"Nou, ik zou alles geven om gitaar te kunnen spelen zoals jij." En daarin ligt het allemaal. Dat is precies waar het aan ligt. Doe iets , maakt niet uit wat het is.
Emily
Ja, speel naar je vaardigheden, en maak je geen zorgen over wat je niet kunt doen, denk ik.
Jeff
Juist. En je talenten, door God gegeven. Als je het hebt, moet je het gebruiken.
Emily
Ja, daar ben ik het mee eens. Dus een beetje inspirerend, en misschien moet ik daar nog eens op terugkomen. Het is gewoon een mooie emotionele release. Zingen is een soort zielsreiniging, nietwaar? Als je echt voelt wat je zingt.
Jeff
Het is. En als je het met anderen doet, is er een kameraadschap die je hebt. Wat ik zo leuk vind aan zingen met anderen, is dat iedereen het exacte moment op het exacte tijdstip deelt. Je moet, als je in een groep zingt of als je achtergrond of harmonieën of wat dan ook zingt, je in de zone met alle anderen moet zijn. En zo kun je drie of vier mensen een precies moment in de tijd laten delen. Samen. En waar doe je dat nog meer? (Ik bedoel, als je een teamsport speelt, is dat een andere manier om het te doen...)
De Gaslight Singers op de US Naval Academy in 1963
Emily
Ja, er is gewoon iets aan zingen in een groep dat je echt in het heden brengt, want je moet opletten.
Jeff
Precies. Of je wordt eruit gegooid! Tenzij je het gewoon voor de lol doet, dan maakt het niet uit.
Emily
Ja, ik heb veel plezier gehad met het zingen met niet-key zangeressen. Ze waren toondoof, maar oh de vreugde! Ze hadden zoveel plezier. In mijn zanggroep op de universiteit, toen we aan het opnemen waren, plaatsten we onze microfoons in een cirkel. Zingen in die kring, je kon elkaar echt horen. Geweldige herinneringen.
Jeff
Nou, vroeger en in de tijd van de volksmuziek noemden ze het hootenannies. Ik heb het over de zeer, zeer vroege jaren 60. Kingston Trio was erg groot en iedereen wilde folkzanger worden. Dus gingen we naar Washington Square Park in Greenwich Village, en iedereen kwam opdagen met banjo's en gitaren of wat ze ook maar speelden en gewoon als cluster samen, liedjes samen speelden, samen liedjes zingen, en dan verder gaan naar een ander cluster. En het was geweldig. Dat zie je niet meer.
Emily
Dat klinkt eigenlijk fantastisch – een openluchtzang.
Jeff
Ja, en het werd gefaciliteerd door het genre. Als je heavy metal doet, is het moeilijk om dat te doen. Maar volksmuziek - het wordt niet voor niets "volksmuziek" genoemd. Weet je, je had niet eens een instrument nodig. Je zou gewoon kunnen komen opdagen en meezingen.
Emily
Ja, barstte gewoon a capella uit. Nou, hey, het was geweldig om met je over muziek te praten, aangezien ik het album heb gedownload met een foto van jou en Cody erop. We zouden het over Cody moeten hebben, maar ik denk dat ik waarschijnlijk nog lang met je over muziek kan praten.
Jeff
Nou, als je me aan Cody begint... Je kunt maar beter lunchen, want ik kan de hele dag over hem praten!
Jeff
Weet je, ik heb hem op het album gezet. Het was gewoon iets dat in me opkwam, en dat is hoe de meeste dingen met mij gebeuren. Ik krijg ineens een idee. En ik kreeg de gedachte hoe cool het zou zijn - omdat hij zo mooi is - hoe cool het zou zijn om hem samen met mij op de cover te zetten. En ik dacht, als er niets anders is, zal hij de aandacht krijgen in plaats van mij, en misschien zullen mensen de cd kopen.
Emily
Dat was echt een goede marketingstrategie.
Jeff
Dat was het; het was vooral een marketingstrategie. Dus dat is wat er is gebeurd. Toen we de fotoshoot voor het album deden, kwam de man en nam veel foto's (had een geweldige fotograaf), en daar was hij - oude Cody.
Emily
Nou, het ding aan hem is, met al dat haar, hij is gewoon zo herkenbaar. Ik bedoel, praten over het hebben van een merk. Ik heb nog nooit een andere Collie gezien met zo'n gezichtshaar, de pony (of hoe je ze ook noemt) voor de oren is heel, heel uniek. Dus telkens als hij opdook in de Collie [Facebook]-groepen, wist je meteen dat het Cody was van het haar. Bij andere honden zijn er zoveel sable en witte collies. Je zegt:"Welke is dat? Ken ik die persoon?” Maar bij hem vraag je je nooit af. Het is als:"Oh ja, dat is zeker Cody."
Jeff
Nou, dat is zijn handelsmerk. Ik krijg daar de hele tijd opmerkingen over. Ik heb net een foto van hem gepost - ik weet niet of je hem hebt gezien - ongeveer een week geleden. Dat haar dat hij heeft:mensen noemen hem Fabio, Rod Stewart... Hij heeft die look. Als hij zijn hoofd schudt, staat het op als Einstein. En onlangs kwam ik de trap op, en ik ging de hoek om, en hij staat daar gewoon naar me te kijken met dat haar recht in de lucht. Ik pakte gewoon mijn telefoon, nam de foto en plaatste hem in de Rough Collie [Facebook]-groep. Vanaf vandaag heeft het ongeveer 932 reacties gekregen en ongeveer 175 reacties.
Emily
Dat is veel om bij te houden!
Jeff
Dat is het zeker. En ik reageer op elke opmerking, in ieder geval met een hartje of zo.
Emily
Om te erkennen dat het gezien is?
Jeff
Ja. Hij is erg populair omdat - het haar. Iedereen vraagt me er altijd naar.
Emily
Ja, ik denk dat ik dat heb gezien en becommentarieerd. Je weet wel, alleen die pure gekke geniale energie. Toen heb ik je een bericht gestuurd en het leidde tot... Weet je, ik heb eerder een foto van Cody gebruikt. Waarom heb ik hem niet als uitgelichte afbeelding gebruikt? (Degene die verschijnt als je een link naar een artikel plaatst.) En toen dacht ik:Nou, hé, als ik hem een uitgelichte afbeelding ga geven, waarom geef ik hem dan niet zijn eigen verhaal? ? Toen dacht ik:Nou, Jeff lijkt wel een gesprek leuk te vinden . Dus jij bent mijn proefkonijn, Jeff. Jij bent mijn podcast-proefkonijn - jij en Cody. We zullen zien hoe dit gaat.
Jeff
Nou, ik ben vereerd. Wil je dat ik je iets over hem vertel en hoe we aan hem zijn gekomen?
Emily
Ja! Dus je had me iets verteld over hoe je in Collies kwam met je vrouw, met de blue merle Ricky, die voorbestemd was om showhond te worden, en toen adopteerde je hem. Dus begin bij het begin denk ik. Ik vond het heel leuk wat je zei over het hebben van Labs [Labrador Retrievers], dat ze zijn als de man op het feest met de lampenkap op zijn hoofd.
Jeff
Juist, precies. Zo omschrijf ik ze. Ik heb Labs gehad. Ik heb veel honden gehad. Eigenlijk was mijn eerste een Duitse Kortharige Pointer, die we als puppy cadeau kregen toen mijn vrouw ongeveer acht maanden zwanger was van ons eerste kind. Dus het was een beetje uitdagend.
Jeff
But I had Labs for most of my life and I loved them. You know, they’re just the friendly guys and gals, and they love you, and they’re happy. Some of them are very exuberant. Some of them are more laid-back. That’s why I use the term that they’re like the guy with the lampshade on his head at the party, because that’s their nature. And I always had them.
Jeff
Then I met Donna, my current wife, and she came from a family that was a college family.
Jeff
Her brother, when he was eight years old, was a huge Lassie fan. Everything just revolved around Lassie. One year he went to camp, and while he was away, his parents got him a collie puppy which they named Happy.
Emily
Aww, that’s a good name.
Jeff
And this was everything to Jimmy – everything to him. He was always a huge Collie fan. Then later on in life, he had 4 of them at the same time. That’s what he had when I met Donna. So I go to his house, and there were these 4 Collies. They actually looked a little odd to me because I wasn’t used to the long nose. I didn’t know anything about them. And they went about their business, as Collies will do.
Jeff
Then when Donna and I got engaged, Jimmy gave us a Collie as an engagement present and he was the most magnificent blue merle. He was 8 months old when we got him. Like you said, he was supposed to be a show dog, but they changed their mind. I used to say that he was born white, and Picasso filled in the rest. That’s how beautiful he was with his coloring. I would take him out and people would say, “Oh my God, he’s so beautiful!”
Jeff
And Ricky had a much different personality than Cody. Ricky was very circumspect. My son described him as he was like Joe DiMaggio, Joe D – just smooth as silk, a lot of class, you know? That kind of a thing. He knew how to work a room.
Jeff
I noticed when we first got him that we’d call him, when we’d be in the bedroom, and he’d come to the door. He’d look, he’d just take the measure of the room, see what was going on – I could see the wheels turning – then he would decide whether he would come in or not. And that was his personality. He was very sweet, very loving, very protective – but circumspect. You know, a little on the… cool side.
Jeff
Cody, on the other hand, is totally different. He loves everybody. He can’t wait to interact with everybody:the tail is going, and he’s smiling. I take him to the dog park, and he doesn’t really bother with the dogs. He’s always working the humans for butt rubs and things like that. He’s just got a totally different nature, just the sweetest guy.
Emily
So Cody thinks everyone’s there for him. That’s why they came?
Jeff
Yeah, Cody thinks that everybody loves him as much as we do. And I could see why, because he’s never had any interaction with a human that was unpleasant. They always flock to him.
Jeff
He flew with us in the cabin three times. We went to Florida one year and back. Then the flight out here to California, and he flew in the cabin with us. He sat on a seat, in between the two of us when we came here, for six hours and didn’t move a muscle. He just sat. He had water; he had pretzels. If he’s with us, he’s cool. That’s his thing. And everybody made such a fuss over him, as you can imagine. And he loves that. He just loves people – children in particular.
Emily
Wow, he’d be a great therapy dog. You could take him anywhere.
Jeff
He would. You know, I’ve been wanting to get him – I can’t do it now because of Covid – but I’ve been wanting to get him to like, nursing homes with seniors.
Emily
Oh, they would love him! They would eat him up.
Jeff
Exactly. Or even hospices. You know, one of the Collies in the group does that. (Only one that I know of.) And Cody brings such joy to people; they light up when they see him. I thought it would be really nice to bring a little light into their lives. So when we’re able to do that, we will.
Emily
Yeah, it sounds like he would be ideal, and everyone would say, “Lassie!” Then they would probably ask why Lassie’s hair kept growing.
Jeff
They say, “Lassie” all the time. When I had Ricky, the merle, one guy looked at him and he said, “Lassie in camouflage.” I thought that was pretty funny.
Emily
Yeah, that’s a perfect description of a merle. They’re just so unique looking. So did you have any Collies between Ricky and Cody?
Jeff
No. When Ricky died (he got cancer and he died at 11 years old), we were looking at retirement. So we said to ourselves, “I don’t think it makes sense to get another Collie now, because we’re thinking about retiring and suppose we want to travel? Maybe we shouldn’t.”
Jeff
It only took a week without a Collie. The house was so dark, spiritually and emotionally without Ricky, because we just loved Ricky with all of our hearts, obviously. And it was like the light went out, and the house was unbearable. And we said, “No, no, we’ve got to get another one!”
Jeff
But it took a while, because what’s interesting is you never see Collies. I mean, I never see them anywhere. But yet when you go to get one, it’s not that easy. My brother-in-law had a relationship with one of the really good breeders in the area. And after about four weeks, she found a puppy in Pennsylvania, at a breeder that she works with. So Donna and I got in the car on a Saturday, drove to Pennsylvania, and picked up Cody. From the moment he got out of the car at our house, he was just calm and at home – and it was just amazing! I have a video of it on YouTube actually, of the first day, of how we got him.
Emily
Oh, you also have a YouTube channel! We’ll have to put that in a link.
Jeff
I do. I have a couple of them actually.
Emily
So what are your YouTube channels?
Jeff
Well, one is “Jeff Hyman Music,” and the other one is just “Jeff Hyman.” I wish that the content was as easily definable, but I have music on one on the Jeff Hyman channel before I did the Jeff Hyman Music channel, and I think the Cody video – it’s called Cody Comes Home to Stamford” – is on the Jeff Hyman channel. If anybody wants to see it, they could just Google it. I’ve got Ricky videos on there. I did a video of Ricky actually “talking,” and it was about 30 minutes of him telling us what it was like to live with us, what life in the Hyman house was like from his own perspective. “Ricky in His Own Words,” I think that’s what I called it.
Emily
Okay, I like that idea. We’ll definitely put links, because I think people will enjoy that for sure. So how old was Cody when you got him?
Jeff
Ricky was eight months. Cody was eight weeks, and he was just very easy from the beginning. He wasn’t much of a chewer, but we made sure that he had lots of things to chew on. And he was very calm.
Emily
How easy was he to potty train? You were probably answering that next!
Jeff
Yeah, I was just going to say, we crate trained him. He got the idea pretty quickly. I guess he just maybe needed to figure out how to control it, so I’m going to say maybe three weeks.
Emily
That’s actually really good. I mean, some people talk about how easy their Collie puppies were to potty train compared to other breeds. You know, other breeds can take a year or more sometimes. Most people I talked to say that their Collies were potty trained within a few months, definitely under a year. So that is pretty incredible.
Jeff
Maybe four weeks – no more than that.
Emily
I mean, I believe you! Some people have said a week or two. It’s just really remarkable how they can pick it up so quickly sometimes.
Jeff
Yeah, well, after about three or four weeks, what we did was:there were two entrances to the kitchen, so I got a couple of gates and then we would leave him in the kitchen. So he didn’t have to be in the crate, but he couldn’t get out of the kitchen. The kitchen had a tile floor, so if anything happened…
Emily
Oh, that’s perfect!
Jeff
Yeah, and he had an occasional accident, but he was young. For the most part, he did pretty well.
Jeff
But Ricky, on the other hand, pooped on my carpet his whole life. I’m not saying he did it all the time (fortunately, it wasn’t that often), but he did it. I mean, my living room carpet – forget it. We used to call it the old Indian dumping grounds, because he would invariably have a surprise for us every now and then.
Emily
Oh, wow… So would you recommend Cody’s breeder to other people?
Jeff
Unquestionably. Can I say who it is?
Emily
Yeah, yeah – that would be great.
Jeff
Oh, okay. It’s Cando Collies, and the owner, Linda Wooleyhan, is a great breeder. Cody’s mother is one of Linda’s Collies. His father is a Milas Collies:that would be Lynn Butler. She’s got champions all over the world, Lynn does. So Cody came out of Cando, and I would recommend Cando – or Lynn – in a heartbeat. High quality, and they know what they’re doing.
Emily
Well, perfect, because we have a breeder directory on Collie Chatter, and we like to list breeders that have been recommended by other people as having good Collies.
Jeff
That’s a big help. When people are looking for one, that’s an excellent guide to have. Because otherwise, if you don’t know, it’s easy to get involved with a breeder that you shouldn’t be.
Emily
Right, yeah. So it’s definitely a word of mouth, trusted source sort of thing. Like, “We’ve had a good experience, and we think you would too.” I think that helps people, when they’re searching.
Jeff
Oh yeah, definitely.
Emily
So my next question… When Cody was a puppy, was there any indication that fantastic fur would grow in, or did he look normal?
Jeff
You mean on his head? No. If you look at the picture on the album cover – now let’s see, how old would he have been? Maybe he was a year old at the time when that picture was taken.
Emily
Oh, so he was still a baby!
Jeff
Yeah, maybe a little more:it’s possible. But his hair in that picture is spiked, and it wasn’t that long. That’s why it was at a length where it just stood up. It was pretty cute, actually, where it stood up.
Jeff
But as he got older, it grew and grew and grew until finally it is what it is now. It’s very long and very unique. It’s also very fine. People say to me, “Well, can you style it, you know, put a little gel in it?” I’ve tried to braid it, because I thought that would be cool; but it’s too fine. It won’t hold the braid.
Jeff
I have one picture… A friend of mine came over and put a rubber band in it down by the base of his head, so that it stood up. And he looked like a Japanese samurai in that picture!
Emily
Oh, perfect!
Jeff
But there’s really not much you can do with it, you know. It is what it is.
Emily
Well, if you can find that picture and if you want to send in a few more… I’d really like for people to see a sampling of Cody’s hair in different phases, or moods, or static electricity.
Jeff
Alright. I only have, I don’t know, 3,000 pictures, so I should be able to find…
Emily
A few that’ll do?
Jeff
Yeah, you don’t need all 3,000.
Emily
Probably not, but, you know, a good sampling of your favorites or his finest moments.
Emily
Have you ever seen another Collie like him, as far as the facial fur, the bangs, or whatever you want to call it? Or is he really in a class by himself?
Jeff
I think that everybody who knows him or sees him would say he’s in a class by himself. I’ve never seen a Collie with hair like that (at that length in the way it is), although others probably do exist. But there are Collies in the group that have similar hair. One of them that comes to mind is this Collie Izzy who’s owned by Carolyn G. Izzy is a girl, she’s beautiful, and she has hair very similar to Cody’s; but it’s not quite as full or long.
Emily
The male Collies always seem to just have a little more majestic flow to their fur in general.
Jeff
Yeah, and the other thing is that Cody also has an amazingly full coat. Ricky didn’t. Ricky’s coat was was flatter, but Cody is like thick and lush. So the combination of that coat and his hair kind of make him very special. People have to see him to understand, because I’m sure that most people that will be listening have never seen anything like it. I mean, every time I post a picture of him or a video or anything, there’s always, always a lot of comments about his hair – even from people who have commented ten times about his hair already. It’s just something that people notice.
Emily
It is incredible. Every time I see a photo, I laugh. Like, “There’s Cody again.” Just his existence brings joy to people who see the photos, I think.
Jeff
That’s so sweet. You know, people tell me that all the time. He also has an infectious smile. You can see how happy and joyful he is in his pictures, and I think people pick up on that. And when people say to me, “Oh, you made my day; I’m so happy right now.” Or, “I really feel better…” It really, really makes me feel good. Het doet. I’m happy that they react that way to him.
Emily
I guess that’s one of the the beauties of the Internet now. In the Rough Collies international Facebook group, you know, 16,500 people all over the world just loving their Collies together… It is pretty amazing.
Jeff
It is, and that’s only one group! There are other groups. But I’ve been a member of the Collie group since 2009. I was in a pet store one day – I had Ricky then – and this woman comes up to me. She has a Collie, and we get talking, and she tells me about this group. So I said, “Oh, wow, that sounds pretty good. I think I’ll join it.” And I did. I’ve just been an addicted member, I guess, for the last 11 years. There’s not a day that goes by that I don’t scroll through and interact with what I call my “Collie family.”
Jeff
I did, I think about 11 Collie videos that are also available on YouTube. Those videos have pictures (sometimes a little bit of video, but it’s mostly pictures) of Collies in the group from all over the world. Each video has a different theme to it. One video shows a plane flying from point A to point B on a globe, and say it lands in Texas. Then the next thing you’ll see are Collies from Texas, and each picture has the name of the Collie. Then the plane flies to the next state, which is Alabama, and the Alabama pictures play.
International travel video featuring photos of Collies worldwide
Jeff
So every video has a different theme and a different way of exploring the geography of where these amazing Collies are from. And the music is good, you know, there’s music underneath the video and all of that. I have a section in there which I called “In Memoriam,” and those are the dogs that passed. It’s a lot of work, because I have to extract all of these pictures from Facebook and then organize them. So I haven’t done one in a couple of years:I’m just kind of a little burnt out on them. But they’re there, if anybody is interested in seeing them. There’s about 10 or 11 of them on YouTube.
Emily
Yeah, I’ll check it out. The guy who actually designed Collie Chatter – I just write the content, he makes it pretty – can probably relate more to the work that goes into those videos, because he likes to do stuff like that. But we’ll go through and put some links so people can view the archives.
Jeff
Yeah, I really think that your listeners, being Collie people, would enjoy these because everybody does. I got a great reaction to them. And what could be so bad about 30 minutes of beautiful Collies with some good music?
Emily
Yeah, that’s fantastic. It’s just so great to me that Rough Collies in particular (I know, Smooth Collies too), but Rough Collies in particular are so associated with Lassie that people know what they are worldwide. And not every breed has that. So it’s very much a uniting factor.
Jeff
Oh, yeah, there’s no question. What’s interesting to me is the fact that I never see any. The only time I see a Collie is every October. There’s a rescue group here, Southland Collie Rescue, and they run an event at one of the dog parks. You know, everybody comes with Collies. I always go (I take Cody, obviously) and there’s maybe 25 Collies there. And that’s the only time I ever see a Collie.
Jeff
People always tell me when I meet ’em 0n the street… (Cody is like a magnet:everybody wants to touch him and chat.) And they say to me, “Oh you know, when I was a kid I had a Collie.” And I think to myself, If you had a Collie when you were a kid, how could you possibly not have one now?
Emily
Yeah, those of us who are breed addicts… (Uh, ME.) I will always have a Collie. I had ’em when I was a kid, and I can’t imagine not having a Collie now.
Jeff
Yeah, exactly. So it’s a mystery to me that I just never see them. Back East was the same thing. I never saw a Collie. I could go anywhere, and occasionally maybe I’d see one. Actually when we came out to visit here in California the first time… We didn’t have Cody with us; we were just visiting our kids for a week. We went into Fashion Island, which is a big mall out here. We come out of one of the stores, and lo and behold, right in front of us is this beautiful Collie. We couldn’t believe it. I think it’s the only one I’ve ever seen, outside of the get-together. I don’t get it.
Emily
Now I’m in Jacksonville, Florida, so I have met a few Collies at dog parks. It’s a city of about one million people, but I’ve only seen a few. I see lots of other breeds, but Collies are just not that common anymore. I was just looking this up the other day. Collies are ranked 38th in popularity, according to how many get registered with the AKC (the American Kennel Club) every year. When you think about it… There’s *200 breeds, I wanna say, that are recognized by the AKC. So 38th in popularity is actually closer to the top.
Jeff
Well, I’d like to see the other 37!
Emily
I think they’re probably in the show ring prancing around, maybe not as much with the general public. I think the fur kind of puts people off.
Jeff
I was just going to say, a very common question when I’m out with Cody is people will say to me, “Oh, he’s probably a lot of work, right? Does he shed a lot? Collies shed a lot, right?”
Jeff
And then I have to explain to them that they have topcoats and undercoats. Cody – and Ricky didn’t either – is not a big shedder. I mean, my Labs used to shed a lot more, because they’ve got short hair and the hairs fall out. They grow to a certain length; they fall out. But with the Collies, it’s always the undercoat where the the big growth is. When you brush them, all of that comes out. But I don’t get a lot of topcoat shedding, do you?
Emily
No, I tell people other than the big pre-summer blowout (once a year with my male and twice a year with my female), Collie shedding is not that bad. If you devote 10 to 20 minutes once a week and you keep up on it, it’s very manageable. A Collie friend of mine told me that when she needs to clean up the hair, she just turns on her ceiling fan, all the little fur tumbleweeds blow into the corners, and she collects it that way. I thought, That’s very ingenious .
Jeff
It is. There’s no question.
Emily
And you can kind of ball it up between your fingers. It’s not spiky. I know what you mean, because I had Labs growing up, too. Collie fur doesn’t really poke you. It’s soft, so it’s different.
Jeff
Exactly. We take Cody once a week for a 15 minute brush. It used to be (when PetSmart was doing it pre-Covid) it was $8 for a 15 minute brush. Our backs can’t do it anymore:if we try to brush him, we suffer. So we would take him over to PetSmart. We had a great guy over there, and after 15 minutes he’d come out all puffy and clump-free. Then they stopped doing it because the Covid. Now they’ll do baths and brushes, but they won’t do just brushes. The vet has a groomer, and we take Cody there. He gets his 15 minute brush every Monday. It keeps him good, you know, clump-free for the most part. That’s all it takes. It’s not hard.
Jeff
The other thing I always like to talk about when we talk about our Collies – this is for all dogs – I’m a very big believer and advocate for brushing their teeth. I did a video on what I do with Cody. Now Cody is six years old, and if you look at his teeth, they’re pearly white and there’s no redness at all around his gums.
Jeff
When we had Ricky, he got to a point where I wasn’t doing that, and I had to have his teeth done (dental cleaning). They have to anesthetize them for that. Donna and I went to the diner [while we were waiting], and we were nervous wrecks. We just swore that was never going to happen again. After that, I started being very vigorous with his teeth brushing.
Jeff
And I do that with Cody every night after he eats. He gets fed once a day in the evening, then I brush his teeth with a manual brush, then with an electric brush. Then I have this antiseptic gel that I put onto his gums. He doesn’t get anything to eat after that so that his mouth is clean for 24 hours. (Actually, he gets a treat in the morning when I walk him when he comes back.) And that has really worked wonders on his oral health and his mouth. A lot of Collies – any dogs – just like people can have a lot of trouble if they have bad gums. So I always advocate that.
Emily
Yeah, and that’s excellent advice, especially with so many Collies having the MdR1 gene concern. So for them to get anesthetized can be… I mean, you were talking about the the anxiety that went with that.
Jeff
Oh, it’s awful!
Emily
For sure, because we know that so many of them do have sensitivities to those drugs. So, yeah, the tooth care is excellent advice, really. And that’s a good idea to do it after the meal. I don’t always do the daily brushing after each meal, and I should.
Jeff
If you skip a day or two, it’s not the end of the world; but really it needs to be done as frequently as possible. And the timing is key, because if you brush their teeth and then they eat, you know, what’s the point?
Jeff
It’s always best after the last meal of the day, and then to hold off on treats. Because anything in their mouth [like food particles] is probably better not being in there. I just am maniacal about that. The thought of him having to be anesthetized just – I don’t like that.
Emily
Yeah, that’s definitely a nerve-wracking thing. Great advice, thank you. You said it’s some sort of gel… Do you have any particular brand that you recommend?
Jeff
Yes, it’s called [Virbac] C.E.T. Enzymatic Toothpaste. I use the poultry flavor. Cody likes it. I think they make a beef, then there’s a clear one. The gel is called Oratene Enzymatic Brushless Oral Care. You just put a little on your finger, and you rub it on the upper gums. That’s like an anti-bacterial, so the brushing and the gel does a good job.
Jeff
I mean, I’m very lucky because my Collies were cooperative. They let me put electric toothbrushes in their mouth. A lot of dogs don’t even let you put a toothbrush in their mouth. And if you can’t get a brush into the mouth, you know, you try to do it a little slowly. They have these finger brushes, which can work pretty effectively. It just slips over your index finger and you can try to do it that way.
Emily
Yeah, I’ve noticed one of my Collies seems to prefer the finger brush and one of them prefers more of the traditional dog toothbrush. One of them likes the peanut butter toothpaste. One likes – it’s almost flavorless, I think – like a clear gel toothpaste. So they definitely have their preferences, and it’s taken a bit of work to get them used to that.
Emily
I used to be a veterinary technician. My first job when I was 16 was working at a vet clinic. There were some dogs, I mean – good luck getting anything in their mouth without having puncture wounds in your hand. So I’m really grateful that Collies – they might not like it, but they’re not going to put a hole in your fingers either. They’re very tolerant and gentle and just safe .
Jeff
They are. That’s what makes them so amazing. Their spirit, their gentle nature. I always say they’re humans in a Collie’s body. I really believe that. They have this elegant majesty to them, and that’s the physical beauty. People constantly say to me, “Oh, he’s so beautiful!” I always tell them that he’s more beautiful on the inside. Because Collies have sweet, loving, loyal, gentle natures to them. They’re just the most amazing creatures.
Emily
Yeah, the substance matches the outside. I’d say their exterior really reflects their interior. Just beautiful inside and out; you put it really well. And that’s actually something that gets Googled a lot, because we’ve been looking at what questions people are asking Google on a monthly basis.
Jeff
About Collies?
Emily
Mm-hmm. Collie-specific questions. “What’s the Collie personality type?” “What are the Collie personality quirks?” “What are the Collie personality characteristics?” And it’s just funny to see that getting searched so much.
Emily
One of the things that gets asked, like you said – the hair care. “I want a Collie, but I don’t know if I could keep up with the grooming.” I think it reflects what people are thinking. Like, “Oh, I think I could handle the grooming, if I know what their temperament is like.” And to me, it’s absolutely worth it – every minute of tooth brushing or coat brushing – absolutely worth it for the kind of dog that you get.
Jeff
There’s no question. I always say that Cody has ‘two and help’ (me and Donna), because we exist to take care of him and service him. When we make dinner at night, say I’m in the kitchen or Donna’s in the kitchen making his dinner, he lies just outside of the kitchen and waits for his service. And then he’s served, and that’s it. You know, when we’re not with him, we’re talking about him. It’s Cody 24/7, and anything he needs –
Emily
The Cody Show!
Jeff
Yeah. We trip over ourselves to give it to him, but he deserves it because he’s such a beautiful soul and loves us so much. Anything I ask of him – anything – he does. I take him out – he’s off leash in the park, let’s say. We’re walking around and I say to him, “Cody, this way.” And he just turns around, follows me. And he understands everything.
Emily
Isn’t that beautiful? I tell people, their fur is the hardest thing about them, and that to me isn’t even that hard. And I have a profusely-coated male Rough Collie. So sometimes the brushing…
Jeff
Is it a sable?
Emily
Yeah, he’s a tri-factor – the dark mahogany sable. So maybe once a year in that summer blowout, I think, Why do I have a dog with such thick fur? But that’s once a year, and every other time they’re so easy to me.
Jeff
There’s no question.
Emily
You know, some people say, “Oh, my dog can do 20 tricks.” Yeah, but… Do you have to chase them down the street? Do they come when you call them? Can you let them off leash and have them stay right with you? And to me, that’s what I value more.
Jeff
Of course!
Emily
I don’t care how many tricks [a dog can do] or if they have all their toys named. I love that they’re so responsive, and the bond… I could talk about that all day. I love it.
Jeff
Well, me too. But you know, there is one other thing about a Collie that I guess is a downside. Je moet heel voorzichtig zijn. Their stomachs – Collies have very sensitive stomachs. And I find with Cody, if we – well, how can I put this? I mean, he has his normal dinner, which is kibble, pumpkin, sweet potato, and we’ll give him some fresh salmon.
Emily
Oh, he’s spoiled!
Jeff
He needs an “accelerant” every now and then – because I don’t know about your guys or gals – but frequently he’ll go to his dinner, poke his nose around, and walk away. And he won’t eat it. So we give them what we call accelerants. So we put like some salmon in there, and then he’ll eat it and he’s fine. We don’t ever give him anything else. Not because we think it’s wrong to give him chicken or beef or sausage. I know some people give their Collies fried chicken, believe it or not. If they can tolerate it, that’s great. But Collies have a tendency – if you vary their diets or whatever, they can have diarrhea for days.
Emily
Mm-hmm. Yeah, that’s one thing. My female is a farm Collie who came from South Carolina, and she can have just about anything. She’s not quite Lab level when it comes to gut strength, but not much bothers her. And then Gus, you know, he’s from a show line and actually from a breeder. So I don’t know if that makes any difference at all; but I can’t switch his food unless I’m very carefully adjusting the portions as I go. He does great on Purina One or the Purina Pro Plans. We’ve tried several others, but – pardon me for saying this – but it is literally a shit show!
Jeff
No it is! That’s exactly what it is!
Emily
So I have learned not to do that. And I’ve also had to be very careful, even with the chews that I give him. A lot of Collies, they’re just not chewers like other breeds of dogs are.
Emily
One of our Labs – we lived out in the country growing up – and she would run into the farmer’s field, yank out an entire stalk of corn, bring it back into our yard, shuck the corn, and eat it cob and all. I mean, she would eat whatever happened to be in the field, because the farmer rotated the fields. She would dig up sugar beets and eat them. You know, we tried to discourage that…
Jeff
Well, but if she could handle it.
Emily
Oh yeah. That dog ate an entire sponge once. We were washing the car, and we made the mistake of setting a sponge down. And whatever cleaner or wax was on that sponge – not a problem, not an issue! I’m glad that Collies don’t eat whatever is laying on the ground. They wouldn’t be able to handle it, if they did.
Jeff
Cody would. As you know, all dogs – and Collies have this long snout with the nose at the end of it – they always have their nose to the ground when you’re walking with them, and they need to smell everything. Cody has to smell every leaf. And I never know when he’s got his nose down for a period of time, whether something’s down there that he would eat. But he would. I mean, I have seen him find an old chicken bone or something. I was able to catch it. So I always have to keep my eye on him, because if he gets anything that he shouldn’t… Well, you know what that’s all about.
Emily
Like a toddler, they’ve got to experience it mouth first.
Jeff
Exactly. He does it nose first, but you’re right, the toddlers, the kids, they’re all about mouth first.
Jeff
So the stomach thing is always, I feel, like the sword of Damocles hanging over our head. We never know. (I mean, in my life, if anybody would have told me that I was going to inspect my dog’s poop every day, I would have told them they were crazy. But I do have to pick it up, so I obviously look at it. But I look at it, and if it’s the way it’s supposed to be:then I’m happy. It’s a good day. If it’s not, then I start worrying.
Jeff
Now, the funny thing about the Labs… I was talking about how Cody could be picky. Back in the day, I would give them (the Labs) a can of wet food. And the way I would do it is:I would open one side of the can and punch a hole in the other side, so that I could hold it upside down over the bowl. Then it would just come out and fall into the bowl. Those dogs would eat half of it before it hit the bowl!
Jeff
Cody is like a cat. He goes and he smells. He wants it; he doesn’t want it. I’m not going to have it; maybe I’ll have it now. Nah, I don’t think I’ll have it… And he walks away from it. And frequently I’ll say, “Okay, Cody, have your dinner. I’ll sit with you.” And if I sit with him, he will eat it. So it’s like, he likes the company. Are yours like that?
Emily
Well, Sir Gustav was an only dog for a while, and yes, sometimes I would have to practically beg him to eat and mix enticing things in. And for a while I was going to the butcher shop and getting some ground meat to mix in with his food. I’ve heard of some people feeding their Collies by hand. I’ve never had to go quite that far. But when he was an only dog, he would leave his bowl. He got dinner, but he would graze on it throughout the night. And it might take him all night to decide that he was going to finish it off.
Jeff
Cody will do that.
Emily
Yeah. I ended up adopting a rescue mix (half Australian Shepherd, half Great Pyrenees), and Gus cannot leave food in his bowl:because she will eat it. It will become hers. My female Collie, the farm Collie, she’s pretty food-motivated, too. So Gus has learned not to leave it just sitting there, because it won’t be there.
Jeff
Well, yeah. So maybe that’s an encouragement or an incentive for him to to eat it. Cody doesn’t have that problem. But, you know, Donna gets upset if he doesn’t eat. I just tell her, “Look, you know what? Look at him. Does he look like he’s starving? If he’s hungry, he’ll eat.” And he does. I mean, if he doesn’t eat one night, he’ll probably eat the next.
Emily
Yeah. And I’m glad that they don’t tend to get fat like some other breeds that just naturally lean towards thickness. We were regularly having to put our Labs on diets growing up because they like to get chunky.
Jeff
Yeah they can get heavy.
Emily
Yeah, and to me that’s sort of a perk with Collies. You usually don’t have to worry about them getting fat. They kind of self regulate their eating, and that’s fine with me.
Emily
So we’ve pretty much naturally stumbled into all the questions that I was going to ask you anyway, which is kind of nice. We have hit an hour, and this is great. I’d rather have more to sort through than not enough. One other thing I did want to circle back to:you mentioned Southland Collie Rescue having a Collie gathering. Where is that exactly? I’ll put a link to that.
Jeff
Southland Collies has the event at a dog park in Irvine. You could find their website, actually, and it’ll give you information. It’s usually August or October; it may be coming up soon. It gets a pretty good turnout. A lot of the people from the Collie [Facebook] group that live out here come to it. So it’s really nice because we get an opportunity to actually meet each other.
Jeff
Because we’re all pretty much virtual, most of it. But it’s always good to meet people and see their Collies, and it’s just wonderful. You’re immersed in Collies. How bad can that be?
Emily
Yeah, sounds like heaven on earth, actually.
Jeff
It is.
Emily
We talked about the Collie personality type. If you were trying to explain Collies to someone who didn’t know anything about them and was maybe considering getting one, is there anything else you would tell them that we didn’t already cover?
Jeff
No, I always say that they’re humans trapped inside of a Collie body. They’re extremely smart, very loyal. The level of communication that you can have with them, you have to live with them to experience. I just think that, generally speaking, there’s nothing about Collies that strikes a negative note with me. It’s impossible to describe them, because you have to live with them in order to really experience it. Anything anybody tells you may sound good, but you’ve never experienced anything until you’ve actually lived with a Collie. There’s nothing else I could say about it.
Emily
It’s kind of hard to describe, isn’t it, to put into words? I did a story on a Collie in training to become a Psychiatric Service Dog. So it’s Stephanie’s first Collie and she said, “You know, I heard about it, but I didn’t quite understand the level of vocal range and vocal ability that a Collie has.” Like you said, you have to live with it.
Jeff
To me, the most amazing thing is how they absolutely know what you’re saying and what you mean and what you want. I mean, Cody even knows the pronoun “he.” So if Donna and I say “he” this or “he” that, he knows we’re talking about him. And he’s able to communicate with us. We know what he wants; we know how he’s feeling; we know what’s going on inside his head, just by the way he behaves and looks at us. His eyes tell everything. And it’s actually like having another human that you can talk to that understands your language, understands, you know – everything. I think I’ve had about 11 or 12 dogs in my life, something like that. And I’ve never had anything that comes close to a Collie.
Jeff
And with that, I’m going to have to leave. My grandkids are coming. They’re three and five; I have to get ready!
Emily
Yes, definitely get ready!
Jeff
I’m going to also send the link to Cody’s Toothbrushing Video, because that’s something I feel very strongly about. I really want people to do that.
Emily
Yeah, I’m realizing I need to put more on Collie Chatter for Collie-specific care, because they are such a unique breed in some ways.
Jeff
Exactly. I had a great time talking with you. I really did. You know, it’s interesting being on this side of everything. When I do my radio show I’m the host, and I’m interviewing somebody else and having that conversation. So this was a lot of fun for me, and I could talk about Collies all day.
Emily
Yeah, me too!
Jeff
Thank you for having me.
Emily
Thank you. Have fun with your grandkids, Jeff.
Jeff
I will, Emily. Thank you so much.
* Edit and footnote:The AKC currently registers 197 dog breeds, which means they recognize nearly half of the approximately 400 dog breeds recorded with other breed clubs worldwide. There are also 82 purebreeds under consideration for breed registration with the AKC’s Foundation Stock Service (FSS) program.
Jeff Hyman was a member of the popular Gaslight Singers in the 1960s. He now has a solo career, having released solo albums Old Dogs New Tricks in 2017 and Pick Yourself Up in 2019. Both are available for purchase and streaming on Amazon. Currently, Jeff also hosts the international radio program Somewhere in Time, on which he introduces his listeners to other interesting indie artists and discusses great music of the past. Check out his website and listening options here.
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